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Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 19, 2023 10:03:39 GMT -5
Still haven't been a contender since the core, 3 years and counting and at this point look to take another step back.
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Post by batman66 on Dec 19, 2023 10:13:49 GMT -5
Still haven't been a contender since the core, 3 years and counting and at this point look to take another step back. To avoid shit like this maybe lay down your criteria for what consists of a contender . So far we know it changed from being in a race for a playoff spot late in the season to actually making the playoffs and then from actually making the playoffs to having to win a game in the playoff and then from winning a game in the playoffs to making them multiple seasons in a row , so before we run into more changes in the future if and when they do make the playoffs , maybe just tell us how many that has to be in a row or how many times in a certain span of years. Agree on one thing , unless they get off their ass and do something major it looks like they probably will take a step back. I wouldn't call it "another" step back because I actually consider a team that missed the playoffs by 1 game a contender last season and I know you don't but wouldn't last season be atleast considered a step forward?
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Post by trav768 on Dec 19, 2023 10:36:16 GMT -5
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Post by Mike on Dec 19, 2023 10:48:03 GMT -5
Still haven't been a contender since the core, 3 years and counting and at this point look to take another step back. To avoid shit like this maybe lay down your criteria for what consists of a contender . So far we know it changed from being in a race for a playoff spot late in the season to actually making the playoffs and then from actually making the playoffs to having to win a game in the playoff and then from winning a game in the playoffs to making them multiple seasons in a row , so before we run into more changes in the future if and when they do make the playoffs , maybe just tell us how many that has to be in a row or how many times in a certain span of years. Agree on one thing , unless they get off their ass and do something major it looks like they probably will take a step back. I wouldn't call it "another" step back because I actually consider a team that missed the playoffs by 1 game a contender last season and I know you don't but wouldn't last season be atleast considered a step forward? We did sign Counsell. If Rossy mismanaged 5 games into losses while still winning 82 games with 6 to go last year... Makes sense that they play would be acquire a fresh set of eyes on the farm and better in game management skills.
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Post by batman66 on Dec 19, 2023 11:27:04 GMT -5
To avoid shit like this maybe lay down your criteria for what consists of a contender . So far we know it changed from being in a race for a playoff spot late in the season to actually making the playoffs and then from actually making the playoffs to having to win a game in the playoff and then from winning a game in the playoffs to making them multiple seasons in a row , so before we run into more changes in the future if and when they do make the playoffs , maybe just tell us how many that has to be in a row or how many times in a certain span of years. Agree on one thing , unless they get off their ass and do something major it looks like they probably will take a step back. I wouldn't call it "another" step back because I actually consider a team that missed the playoffs by 1 game a contender last season and I know you don't but wouldn't last season be atleast considered a step forward? We did sign Counsell. If Rossy mismanaged 5 games into losses while still winning 82 games with 6 to go last year... Makes sense that they play would be acquire a fresh set of eyes on the farm and better in game management skills. Counsell was a nice step towards improving but he can't hit cleanup and drive in 90+ runs or pitch every 5th day and the Cubs have pulled a hamstring since they hired him and done nothing so it's nowhere near enough to say they could possibly improve.
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Post by fine09 on Dec 19, 2023 13:11:59 GMT -5
Still haven't been a contender since the core, 3 years and counting and at this point look to take another step back. Just for clarity let's put it all out there as one would in a court of law.. Name of Steve's original thread: "Next Cubs contending team?" Date of Steve's original thread: July 26th. of 2022 (last year) Steve's prediction: "I’m going 2027, maybe 2026." The Cubs were very much contenders for most all of the 2nd. half of this year & it took an almost complete collapse to miss the playoffs by 1 game so by definition that is being competitive. So to summarize in the famous words of Maxwell Smart you "missed it by that much", meaning 3 or 4 years but good try. And FYI, I wouldn't be making a big deal out of this if you weren't so adamant about not being wrong on this & everyone can plainly see that you are wrong so stepping away from the thread is probably the good move at this point..
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Post by bryzzobrist on Dec 19, 2023 14:30:55 GMT -5
Cubs 2023 season had x-w/l of 90 games but only won 83. That's a team that should've contended a bit better
It IS a lil funny that we're all hung up on the contender definition, because wasn't it steve who was up in arms about the re-build/re-tool definition? Atleast there's SOMETHING to read on here, because it's boring out there right now.
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Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 19, 2023 16:41:23 GMT -5
Still haven't been a contender since the core, 3 years and counting and at this point look to take another step back. Just for clarity let's put it all out there as one would in a court of law.. Name of Steve's original thread: "Next Cubs contending team?" Date of Steve's original thread: July 26th. of 2022 (last year) Steve's prediction: "I’m going 2027, maybe 2026." The Cubs were very much contenders for most all of the 2nd. half of this year & it took an almost complete collapse to miss the playoffs by 1 game so by definition that is being competitive. So to summarize in the famous words of Maxwell Smart you "missed it by that much", meaning 3 or 4 years but good try. And FYI, I wouldn't be making a big deal out of this if you weren't so adamant about not being wrong on this & everyone can plainly see that you are wrong so stepping away from the thread is probably the good move at this point.. What a waste of fucking time typing all that up. Get a life dude. "So to summarize in the famous words of Maxwell Smart you "missed it by that much", meaning 3 or 4 years but good try." Still not a contender, what I miss? hahaha Keep making excuses for every missed signing and free agent that someone in the farm is a better option. You're doing great!
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Post by bryzzobrist on Dec 19, 2023 17:38:17 GMT -5
Last year we had the exact same x-w/l record as the WS winner Texas Rangers finished their season with. Contenders? I THINK NOT! =) *proceeds to hurt insults or something*
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Post by batman66 on Dec 20, 2023 9:12:17 GMT -5
Last year we had the exact same x-w/l record as the WS winner Texas Rangers finished their season with. Contenders? I THINK NOT! =) *proceeds to hurt insults or something* I grew up thinking a "contender" in baseball was a team who is fighting for a playoff spot until the end, or even close to it , the last couple weeks of a season atleast and if it;s the last day or two , then that certainly was a contender. And I thought that's how most/all people looked at it ?
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Post by kfidd on Dec 20, 2023 9:37:12 GMT -5
Last year we had the exact same x-w/l record as the WS winner Texas Rangers finished their season with. Contenders? I THINK NOT! =) *proceeds to hurt insults or something* I grew up thinking a "contender" in baseball was a team who is fighting for a playoff spot until the end, or even close to it , the last couple weeks of a season atleast and if it;s the last day or two , then that certainly was a contender. And I thought that's how most/all people looked at it ? It’s subjective. Are the 2023 Dodgers and Braves considered contenders based on their regular season performance? Because they certainly wouldn’t be considered that based on their combined 1-6 record in the playoffs. You can’t contend for a WS title without making the playoffs first, and we’ve seen it time and time again that anything can (and will) happen once you’re in. A contending team is one competing for a playoff spots in my book. That doesn’t have to mean that the 2023 Cubs would be considered equal in their chances to win it all to say the Braves or Dodgers, but again, those teams combined for just one more playoff win than our Cubs did. Compete for a playoff spot = contender. If someone feels different that’s fine. It’s rebuild/retool all over again.
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Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 20, 2023 10:40:01 GMT -5
I grew up thinking a "contender" in baseball was a team who is fighting for a playoff spot until the end, or even close to it , the last couple weeks of a season atleast and if it;s the last day or two , then that certainly was a contender. And I thought that's how most/all people looked at it ? It’s subjective. Are the 2023 Dodgers and Braves considered contenders based on their regular season performance? Because they certainly wouldn’t be considered that based on their combined 1-6 record in the playoffs. You can’t contend for a WS title without making the playoffs first, and we’ve seen it time and time again that anything can (and will) happen once you’re in. A contending team is one competing for a playoff spots in my book. That doesn’t have to mean that the 2023 Cubs would be considered equal in their chances to win it all to say the Braves or Dodgers, but again, those teams combined for just one more playoff win than our Cubs did. Compete for a playoff spot = contender. If someone feels different that’s fine. It’s rebuild/retool all over again. It's not subjective at all. This is the Cubs fan thought process of a currently losing organization. Cub fans can dance around the word all the want, they know damn well what it's in reference to and any Cub fan would trade rosters with either of those teams today going forward knowing every season they will likely CONTEND for a world championship. Dodgers, 11 straight postseason, 10 division titles, 6 NLCS, 3 world series, 1 championship. Braves, 6 straight postseasons, 6 straight division titles, 2 NLCS, 1 championship. Both of these teams will be expected to win their divisions again in 2024 and both of these teams will be expected to CONTEND for a championship in 2024, AGAIN. This is silly and we should just let this thread die already.
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Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 20, 2023 10:42:24 GMT -5
Last year we had the exact same x-w/l record as the WS winner Texas Rangers finished their season with. Contenders? I THINK NOT! =) *proceeds to hurt insults or something* I grew up thinking a "contender" in baseball was a team who is fighting for a playoff spot until the end, or even close to it , the last couple weeks of a season atleast and if it;s the last day or two , then that certainly was a contender. And I thought that's how most/all people looked at it ? No you didn't. You're making excuses for you awful take. Cubs were competing for the division, which they NEVER took 1st in, but they were never contenders in the MLB to win a championship. Stick with your excuse making take.
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Post by batman66 on Dec 20, 2023 11:03:10 GMT -5
It’s subjective. Are the 2023 Dodgers and Braves considered contenders based on their regular season performance? Because they certainly wouldn’t be considered that based on their combined 1-6 record in the playoffs. You can’t contend for a WS title without making the playoffs first, and we’ve seen it time and time again that anything can (and will) happen once you’re in. A contending team is one competing for a playoff spots in my book. That doesn’t have to mean that the 2023 Cubs would be considered equal in their chances to win it all to say the Braves or Dodgers, but again, those teams combined for just one more playoff win than our Cubs did. Compete for a playoff spot = contender. If someone feels different that’s fine. It’s rebuild/retool all over again. It's not subjective at all. This is the Cubs fan thought process of a currently losing organization. Cub fans can dance around the word all the want, they know damn well what it's in reference to and any Cub fan would trade rosters with either of those teams today going forward knowing every season they will likely CONTEND for a world championship. Dodgers, 11 straight postseason, 10 division titles, 6 NLCS, 3 world series, 1 championship. Braves, 6 straight postseasons, 6 straight division titles, 2 NLCS, 1 championship. Both of these teams will be expected to win their divisions again in 2024 and both of these teams will be expected to CONTEND for a championship in 2024, AGAIN. This is silly and we should just let this thread die already. You made the thread and can't just simply admit you were wrong. If you would have said a team that makes the post season just about every year then nobody would have thought to ever bump it up , but you said contend and most peoples thoughts about a contending team are one who fights for a playoff spot and is playing meaningful baseball the last month or weeks of a season. And to piggyback on your 11 straight, 6 straight stuff , you were complaining to no end the Cubs last core only won 1 championship and that wasn't good enough but hold these teams to the highest regard when the team who's been there 11 straight has only won 1 in a Covid season. I think you just like to bitch about the Cubs.
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Post by batman66 on Dec 20, 2023 11:09:32 GMT -5
I grew up thinking a "contender" in baseball was a team who is fighting for a playoff spot until the end, or even close to it , the last couple weeks of a season atleast and if it;s the last day or two , then that certainly was a contender. And I thought that's how most/all people looked at it ? No you didn't. You're making excuses for you awful take. Cubs were competing for the division, which they NEVER took 1st in, but they were never contenders in the MLB to win a championship. Stick with your excuse making take. So you're going to tell me how I grew up and I just want to make excuses to prove you were wrong ? Which everybody but you knows you were wrong about. Lol , classic epic post right there dude. So now since they never took first, they were competing just for the division but never to win it all? Lol , oh my fucking god. So with that mentality , you admit they were "competing" for the division because it's right there in text. Stay with me here , they were competing for the division which they ended up finishing 9 games back , but they weren't a contender for a worls series because they did not make the post season which they finished 1 game back . How the hell does that work? They clearly were not the best team , we all know what teams were , but those teams did not win , did they ? So what's to say the Cubs could not have had a better playoff had they gotten in ?
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Post by kfidd on Dec 20, 2023 11:14:23 GMT -5
It’s subjective. Are the 2023 Dodgers and Braves considered contenders based on their regular season performance? Because they certainly wouldn’t be considered that based on their combined 1-6 record in the playoffs. You can’t contend for a WS title without making the playoffs first, and we’ve seen it time and time again that anything can (and will) happen once you’re in. A contending team is one competing for a playoff spots in my book. That doesn’t have to mean that the 2023 Cubs would be considered equal in their chances to win it all to say the Braves or Dodgers, but again, those teams combined for just one more playoff win than our Cubs did. Compete for a playoff spot = contender. If someone feels different that’s fine. It’s rebuild/retool all over again. It's not subjective at all. This is the Cubs fan thought process of a currently losing organization. Cub fans can dance around the word all the want, they know damn well what it's in reference to and any Cub fan would trade rosters with either of those teams today going forward knowing every season they will likely CONTEND for a world championship. Dodgers, 11 straight postseason, 10 division titles, 6 NLCS, 3 world series, 1 championship. Braves, 6 straight postseasons, 6 straight division titles, 2 NLCS, 1 championship. Both of these teams will be expected to win their divisions again in 2024 and both of these teams will be expected to CONTEND for a championship in 2024, AGAIN. This is silly and we should just let this thread die already. Of course I would trade our roster for the Braves or Dodgers. What looney wouldn’t? But that wasn’t the original question. If the Cubs win the Centeal in 2024 does that make them contenders?
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Post by batman66 on Dec 20, 2023 11:40:38 GMT -5
It's not subjective at all. This is the Cubs fan thought process of a currently losing organization. Cub fans can dance around the word all the want, they know damn well what it's in reference to and any Cub fan would trade rosters with either of those teams today going forward knowing every season they will likely CONTEND for a world championship. Dodgers, 11 straight postseason, 10 division titles, 6 NLCS, 3 world series, 1 championship. Braves, 6 straight postseasons, 6 straight division titles, 2 NLCS, 1 championship. Both of these teams will be expected to win their divisions again in 2024 and both of these teams will be expected to CONTEND for a championship in 2024, AGAIN. This is silly and we should just let this thread die already. Of course I would trade our roster for the Braves or Dodgers. What looney wouldn’t? But that wasn’t the original question. If the Cubs win the Centeal in 2024 does that make them contenders? No apparently now you have to string multiple post seasons in a row or short span to be a contender.
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Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 20, 2023 11:42:31 GMT -5
Yawn.... I'm backing out of this one. No need to reply, I'm not going to open it anymore.
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Post by kfidd on Dec 20, 2023 11:46:41 GMT -5
Of course I would trade our roster for the Braves or Dodgers. What looney wouldn’t? But that wasn’t the original question. If the Cubs win the Centeal in 2024 does that make them contenders? No apparently now you have to string multiple post seasons in a row or short span to be a contender. Yeah, it’s just a matter of word choice. This thread derailed because it’s irrefutable that the Cubs contended for a playoff spot last season, and ultimately a disastrous final ~3 weeks killed them. It’s also irrefutable that we would love to be in the position the Braves are Dodgers are in, expected to win their division year after year and play in the postseason. This is straight up retool vs rebuild again. But we can compare ourselves to the Dodgers and Braves rosters all we want, but no amount of off-season work would get us to those levels for 2024. The Cubs just need to keep improving. I believe what Counsell said about the organization being extremely healthy and in great shape. Speaking of great shape and building a contender for next season, can we improve the ML roster now plesh? :3
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Post by Cubtastic on Dec 20, 2023 12:05:08 GMT -5
Well I know it will not be this year if they don't add to this roster, that much I do know.
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