|
Post by fine09 on Sept 29, 2023 7:23:39 GMT -5
I guess we'd have to say the Nationals are world champions, but not contenders. I viewed the Nats as contenders that year. In a previous post I mentioned teams can win in the playoffs with 2 aces and a strong/hot pen. The Nats team also won 92 if I recall correctly and were hot going in. And this is something the Cubs don't have this year. If the Cubs makes the playoffs this year no one expects them to advance far. If that is deemed to be contending Cubs fans need to have higher expectations. We all should have higher expectations BUT that isn’t the point in these recent posts, it is if the Cubs are contenders. And to the point that if we make the playoffs we are contenders but if we miss then we aren’t then I guess we have been contenders for the past month but may not be any longer after tomorrow. Regardless of the outcome of making the playoffs every baseball fan knows we are / were contenders which inherently makes them competitive which was my whole suggestion that started Fitz on his latest quest to say that they aren’t. Even my annoying friend (Cardinals fan of course) said that he couldn’t believe they were competitive this soon after the “tear down” as he put it. That should tell you all you need to know..
|
|
|
Post by fine09 on Sept 29, 2023 7:25:46 GMT -5
It doesn't matter how many teams there are to use the word "contender" if you are a team fighting for a playoff spot playing meaniingful baseball until the end of the season you are a contender in my book and I would think most people's. Using the word is not saying they are a favorite to win it all , but they have a chance since anything can happen in a short playoff series. We can even throw out the term all together , Fitz point from the origin as it was in MANY conversations since the selling off of the core was about when they will be a team atleast fighting for a playoff spot again . he knows it , we all know it. No team that didnt make the playoffs or a tournament have won a championship. That is true, they did a study at Texas A&M..
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Oct 13, 2023 7:34:24 GMT -5
I guess no "contenders" will be playing in the WS this season , this is why a lot of us say you just have to be good enough to get in and not be a 100 win team storming through the season.
Top 5 teams with the most wins in the league , a combined 1-13 in the playoffs.
|
|
|
Post by kfidd on Oct 13, 2023 9:05:41 GMT -5
I guess no "contenders" will be playing in the WS this season , this is why a lot of us say you just have to be good enough to get in and not be a 100 win team storming through the season. Top 5 teams with the most wins in the league , a combined 1-13 in the playoffs. Yep! That should never be used as an excuse to not improve the team just because they made the playoffs. But we’ve seen this time and time and time again, all it takes is to get in and anything can happen. What’s that Dodgers stat they shared the other night, something like they haven’t won fewer than 92 games since 2012 or something? And yet they only have one World Series victory in that time, and even that came in the **2020** asterisk riddled season. Don’t worry so much about being “WS contenders” (not you bat) and just keep improving and get into the playoffs consistently.
|
|
|
Post by trav768 on Oct 13, 2023 10:50:34 GMT -5
posted this in anther thread, but really deserves be here too.
During the four-division era from 1969-1993, which covers 25 seasons, the team with the best regular-season record only won the World Series eight times. Here are those squads that did it. 1970 Orioles (108-54) 1975 Reds (108-54) 1976 Reds (102-60) 1978 Yankees (100-63) 1983 Orioles (98-64) 1984 Tigers (104-58) 1986 Mets (108-54) 1989 Athletics (99-63)
since the birth of the wild card in 1995, 7 times has the best regular season record go on to win it all. 1998 Yankees (114-48) 2007 Red Sox (96-66, tied for the best record with Cleveland) 2009 Yankees (103-59) 2013 Red Sox (97-65, tied for the best record with St. Louis) 2016 Cubs (103-58) 2018 Red Sox (108-54) 2020 Dodgers (43-17 in the Covid year)
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Oct 14, 2023 9:16:23 GMT -5
posted this in anther thread, but really deserves be here too. During the four-division era from 1969-1993, which covers 25 seasons, the team with the best regular-season record only won the World Series eight times. Here are those squads that did it. 1970 Orioles (108-54) 1975 Reds (108-54) 1976 Reds (102-60) 1978 Yankees (100-63) 1983 Orioles (98-64) 1984 Tigers (104-58) 1986 Mets (108-54) 1989 Athletics (99-63) since the birth of the wild card in 1995, 7 times has the best regular season record go on to win it all. 1998 Yankees (114-48) 2007 Red Sox (96-66, tied for the best record with Cleveland) 2009 Yankees (103-59) 2013 Red Sox (97-65, tied for the best record with St. Louis) 2016 Cubs (103-58) 2018 Red Sox (108-54) 2020 Dodgers (43-17 in the Covid year) That shows how hard it is to win and we had some people being so critical of the Cubs for not being able to get a second WS out of the old core.
|
|
|
Post by trav768 on Oct 14, 2023 11:14:09 GMT -5
posted this in anther thread, but really deserves be here too. During the four-division era from 1969-1993, which covers 25 seasons, the team with the best regular-season record only won the World Series eight times. Here are those squads that did it. 1970 Orioles (108-54) 1975 Reds (108-54) 1976 Reds (102-60) 1978 Yankees (100-63) 1983 Orioles (98-64) 1984 Tigers (104-58) 1986 Mets (108-54) 1989 Athletics (99-63) since the birth of the wild card in 1995, 7 times has the best regular season record go on to win it all. 1998 Yankees (114-48) 2007 Red Sox (96-66, tied for the best record with Cleveland) 2009 Yankees (103-59) 2013 Red Sox (97-65, tied for the best record with St. Louis) 2016 Cubs (103-58) 2018 Red Sox (108-54) 2020 Dodgers (43-17 in the Covid year) That shows how hard it is to win and we had some people being so critical of the Cubs for not being able to get a second WS out of the old core. also shows just get in playoffs and anything can happen. its a new season and W-L record means nothing. just like spring training means nothing
|
|
|
Post by trav768 on Oct 15, 2023 9:47:24 GMT -5
posted this in anther thread, but really deserves be here too. During the four-division era from 1969-1993, which covers 25 seasons, the team with the best regular-season record only won the World Series eight times. Here are those squads that did it. 1970 Orioles (108-54) 1975 Reds (108-54) 1976 Reds (102-60) 1978 Yankees (100-63) 1983 Orioles (98-64) 1984 Tigers (104-58) 1986 Mets (108-54) 1989 Athletics (99-63) since the birth of the wild card in 1995, 7 times has the best regular season record go on to win it all. 1998 Yankees (114-48) 2007 Red Sox (96-66, tied for the best record with Cleveland) 2009 Yankees (103-59) 2013 Red Sox (97-65, tied for the best record with St. Louis) 2016 Cubs (103-58) 2018 Red Sox (108-54) 2020 Dodgers (43-17 in the Covid year) That shows how hard it is to win and we had some people being so critical of the Cubs for not being able to get a second WS out of the old core. break this down a bit further. adding the wild card teams hasn't really changed much from best regular season record winning it all. before the wild card 8 teams with best record won it all vs 7 in wild card era
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2023 18:23:12 GMT -5
🤣🤣🤣
|
|
|
Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 18, 2023 14:58:34 GMT -5
Yeah, still waiting for that first postseason berth post-Core group.
Contending team: Cubs 2015-2020 making 5 post seasons in 6 years. Contending team: Dodgers have been in the post season 11 straight years (no body said championships, i said contender) Contending team: Astros 8 of the last 9 years postseason berth. Contending team: Braves 6 straight postseasons. Contending team: Yankees 7 of last 9 seasons in the postseason.
I mean, maybe my expectations are different. This offseason can literally push the "Next Contending Team" (multiple seasons) back to 2026-2027. I adjust to 2025 after what the Cubs did last offseason and how they played in 2023, but it doesn't seem to me that the Cubs have any intention of piggybacking on 2023. We'll see.
|
|
|
Post by lajoiesghost on Dec 18, 2023 16:27:56 GMT -5
Fangraphs has The Cardinals 8th? God, that would make me puke. Watching the turds make moves compounds the frustration of the Cubs doing nothing so far.
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Dec 18, 2023 17:29:34 GMT -5
Yeah, still waiting for that first postseason berth post-Core group. Contending team: Cubs 2015-2020 making 5 post seasons in 6 years. Contending team: Dodgers have been in the post season 11 straight years (no body said championships, i said contender) Contending team: Astros 8 of the last 9 years postseason berth. Contending team: Braves 6 straight postseasons. Contending team: Yankees 7 of last 9 seasons in the postseason. I mean, maybe my expectations are different. This offseason can literally push the "Next Contending Team" (multiple seasons) back to 2026-2027. I adjust to 2025 after what the Cubs did last offseason and how they played in 2023, but it doesn't seem to me that the Cubs have any intention of piggybacking on 2023. We'll see. So going by your ever changing current logic of the originality of this thread and a "contending team " It seems there is a hard line 84 wins last season = contending team , 83 wins last season = not a contending team ? Is that correct ?
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Dec 18, 2023 17:39:37 GMT -5
Yeah, still waiting for that first postseason berth post-Core group. Contending team: Cubs 2015-2020 making 5 post seasons in 6 years. Contending team: Dodgers have been in the post season 11 straight years (no body said championships, i said contender) Contending team: Astros 8 of the last 9 years postseason berth. Contending team: Braves 6 straight postseasons. Contending team: Yankees 7 of last 9 seasons in the postseason. I mean, maybe my expectations are different. This offseason can literally push the "Next Contending Team" (multiple seasons) back to 2026-2027. I adjust to 2025 after what the Cubs did last offseason and how they played in 2023, but it doesn't seem to me that the Cubs have any intention of piggybacking on 2023. We'll see. So going by your ever changing current logic of the originality of this thread and a "contending team " It seems there is a hard line 84 wins last season = contending team , 83 wins last season = not a contending team ? Is that correct ?
|
|
|
Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 18, 2023 18:04:38 GMT -5
Yeah, still waiting for that first postseason berth post-Core group. Contending team: Cubs 2015-2020 making 5 post seasons in 6 years. Contending team: Dodgers have been in the post season 11 straight years (no body said championships, i said contender) Contending team: Astros 8 of the last 9 years postseason berth. Contending team: Braves 6 straight postseasons. Contending team: Yankees 7 of last 9 seasons in the postseason. I mean, maybe my expectations are different. This offseason can literally push the "Next Contending Team" (multiple seasons) back to 2026-2027. I adjust to 2025 after what the Cubs did last offseason and how they played in 2023, but it doesn't seem to me that the Cubs have any intention of piggybacking on 2023. We'll see. So going by your ever changing current logic of the originality of this thread and a "contending team " It seems there is a hard line 84 wins last season = contending team , 83 wins last season = not a contending team ? Is that correct ? Maybe you're purposely creating your definition of "contender" for me. I clearly mapped it out with teams that are contenders annually. Cubs previous core was a contender for 6 seasons. What are we talking about here?
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Dec 18, 2023 18:17:20 GMT -5
So going by your ever changing current logic of the originality of this thread and a "contending team " It seems there is a hard line 84 wins last season = contending team , 83 wins last season = not a contending team ? Is that correct ? Maybe you're purposely creating your definition of "contender" for me. I clearly mapped it out with teams that are contenders annually. Cubs previous core was a contender for 6 seasons. What are we talking about here? Wait what? Now it's contenders annually ? I missed seeing that in the title of the thread and any previous replies throughout it until now , I could be wrong and don't feel like looking through all replies but I don't remember the criteria being that it was annually .......so confused? So lets say they get off their asses and make some moves and actually make the playoffs in 2024 , a couple questions before this post takes another future fork in the road. 1. would 2023 by any chance count as to when they were starting to be a contender again since they did miss the playoffs which you seem to pinpoint as part of being a contender by only one game , meaning they were contending for said playoff spot until a final series . Or is that one game disqualifying them from being considered to be a contender altogether.? Ii get ii if it is because they were not in the post season , just want to know for sure for future references. 2. How many seasons in a row does one have to make the actual playoffs to be considered a contender now ?
|
|
|
Post by Mike on Dec 19, 2023 8:30:56 GMT -5
2024-25 - [#1] PCA (L) + [#14], Canario OF, [#21] Vasquez SS, [#13] Mervis (L) 1B, Strumpf 3B/2B --------- 2025-26 - [#18] Murray (S) 3B/1B, [#3] Caissie (L) RF/DH/(1B?), [#27] Aliendo C --------- 2026-27 - [#4] Alcantara OF, [#7] Ballesteros (L) C/1B/DH, [#9] Triantos 2B -> Suzuki/Happ/Hoerner FA transition year
2027, all-farm/signed CF PCA (L) SS Swanson RF Caissie (L) DH Canario 1B Ballesteros (L) / 2B Triantos LF Alcantara 3B Murray (S) / 1B 2B Vasquez / 3B C Amaya / Aliendo
|
|
|
Post by fine09 on Dec 19, 2023 9:16:50 GMT -5
So going by your ever changing current logic of the originality of this thread and a "contending team " It seems there is a hard line 84 wins last season = contending team , 83 wins last season = not a contending team ? Is that correct ? Maybe you're purposely creating your definition of "contender" for me. I clearly mapped it out with teams that are contenders annually. Cubs previous core was a contender for 6 seasons. What are we talking about here? What are we talking about here? Exactly as the thread states: "The next Cubs contending team"The only thing that changed for you was your definition of the original thread from exactly what it was to "Perennial contenders". And for your New & improved definition you are correct that the Cubs aren't there just yet, but that has little to nothing to do with this thread from a long while back.
|
|
|
Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 19, 2023 9:50:27 GMT -5
This thread got dumber as the replies added up. I'll walk away now because the excuses will continue to pile up.
|
|
|
Post by Returnofstevefitz on Dec 19, 2023 9:51:36 GMT -5
Maybe you're purposely creating your definition of "contender" for me. I clearly mapped it out with teams that are contenders annually. Cubs previous core was a contender for 6 seasons. What are we talking about here? What are we talking about here? Exactly as the thread states: "The next Cubs contending team"The only thing that changed for you was your definition of the original thread from exactly what it was to "Perennial contenders". And for your New & improved definition you are correct that the Cubs aren't there just yet, but that has little to nothing to do with this thread from a long while back. Blah blah blah blah.... keep the excuses coming.
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Dec 19, 2023 9:55:41 GMT -5
This thread got dumber as the replies added up. I'll walk away now because the excuses will continue to pile up. Lol, yeah that will happen when the O P changes the gist of the entire thread multiple times. Can you pinpoint one excuse that you are talking about ?
|
|