|
Post by batman66 on Sept 20, 2021 16:05:50 GMT -5
And on top of everything you said , at this point Heyward only seems useful as a mentor. Personally, I don't think Heyward has any usefulness. If Davis needs advice, mentor-ship, it should come from Happ considering all the adverser he has dealt with and seems to be righting the ship.
Lets see... Happ was a highly regarded prospect, came up and had a reasonable run of success, then took a step back, then struggled so bad he was sent down, reworked his swing and came up, had a great run of MVP level success, struggled again and has now righted the ship. Seems like a guy I would seek advice from, a guy who knows adversary, how hard you have to work to get to, stay in and succeed in the league.
Heyward.... be really good, sign a big contract and start sucking. But he gave a really good speech once apparently.... and I actually like Heyward...
It's not just all about career path. Personality has a lot to do with it too. I'm not saying Happ would not be a good mentor, but we all know by seeing Heyward and Ross since the day they became teammates in Chicago and how Heyward spoke out about him and why he was paying his on the road suites his last year as a player, totally gets it.
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 20, 2021 16:18:09 GMT -5
Personally, I don't think Heyward has any usefulness. If Davis needs advice, mentor-ship, it should come from Happ considering all the adverser he has dealt with and seems to be righting the ship.
Lets see... Happ was a highly regarded prospect, came up and had a reasonable run of success, then took a step back, then struggled so bad he was sent down, reworked his swing and came up, had a great run of MVP level success, struggled again and has now righted the ship. Seems like a guy I would seek advice from, a guy who knows adversary, how hard you have to work to get to, stay in and succeed in the league.
Heyward.... be really good, sign a big contract and start sucking. But he gave a really good speech once apparently.... and I actually like Heyward...
It's not just all about career path. Personality has a lot to do with it too. I'm not saying Happ would not be a good mentor, but we all know by seeing Heyward and Ross since the day they became teammates in Chicago and how Heyward spoke out about him and why he was paying his on the road suites his last year as a player, totally gets it. I always think about when someone asked Zobrist who his favorite teammate has been in his entire career- the answer was Heyward. I think personality is very important in this regard, and JHEY beats the heck out of Happ imo as the mentor type. JHEY has nothing to lose right now. Happ needs to focus on his own game.
|
|
|
Post by happtobehere on Sept 20, 2021 16:20:01 GMT -5
Personally, I don't think Heyward has any usefulness. If Davis needs advice, mentor-ship, it should come from Happ considering all the adverser he has dealt with and seems to be righting the ship.
Lets see... Happ was a highly regarded prospect, came up and had a reasonable run of success, then took a step back, then struggled so bad he was sent down, reworked his swing and came up, had a great run of MVP level success, struggled again and has now righted the ship. Seems like a guy I would seek advice from, a guy who knows adversary, how hard you have to work to get to, stay in and succeed in the league.
Heyward.... be really good, sign a big contract and start sucking. But he gave a really good speech once apparently.... and I actually like Heyward...
It's not just all about career path. Personality has a lot to do with it too. I'm not saying Happ would not be a good mentor, but we all know by seeing Heyward and Ross since the day they became teammates in Chicago and how Heyward spoke out about him and why he was paying his on the road suites his last year as a player, totally gets it. Heyward can help Davis be more charitable?
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 20, 2021 17:08:33 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by sosacorks on Sept 20, 2021 18:17:48 GMT -5
He needs his own thread. Guy continues to mash. Can play all OF spots. I think Heyward gets to mentor him next year. Well that is kind of a racist-ass opinion... why does Heyward mentor him? Because they are both black? I don't recall people saying Heyward could mentor Schwarber or Happ...
Go ahead and back track and say it's because Heyward is a veteran...
Huh? Yeah that is a pretty ridiculous assessment from someone who seems to be a level headed poster. Maybe they want Hayward to mentor because hes a good outfielder and he is a veteran player. Maybe Hayward should be the mentor because he shouldn't be playing and the younger guys need to get a chance ahead of his known commodity. To say it's racist because their both black is just complete idiocy. Honestly I haven't looked at this board in days but I really hope that was a joke.
|
|
|
Post by fine09 on Sept 20, 2021 18:36:41 GMT -5
And on top of everything you said , at this point Heyward only seems useful as a mentor. Personally, I don't think Heyward has any usefulness. If Davis needs advice, mentor-ship, it should come from Happ considering all the adverser he has dealt with and seems to be righting the ship.
Lets see... Happ was a highly regarded prospect, came up and had a reasonable run of success, then took a step back, then struggled so bad he was sent down, reworked his swing and came up, had a great run of MVP level success, struggled again and has now righted the ship. Seems like a guy I would seek advice from, a guy who knows adversary, how hard you have to work to get to, stay in and succeed in the league.
Heyward.... be really good, sign a big contract and start sucking. But he gave a really good speech once apparently.... and I actually like Heyward...
Sadly his only failure was to sign his deal after a really good year. He has never hit higher than .293, never had more than 82 RBI’s, never had more than 27 HR’s & averaged an OPS+ of around 117 in his career before he signed. He just didn’t “progress” like the Cubs had hoped which is sad for us but that was our fault, not his..
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 20, 2021 20:24:32 GMT -5
Personally, I don't think Heyward has any usefulness. If Davis needs advice, mentor-ship, it should come from Happ considering all the adverser he has dealt with and seems to be righting the ship.
Lets see... Happ was a highly regarded prospect, came up and had a reasonable run of success, then took a step back, then struggled so bad he was sent down, reworked his swing and came up, had a great run of MVP level success, struggled again and has now righted the ship. Seems like a guy I would seek advice from, a guy who knows adversary, how hard you have to work to get to, stay in and succeed in the league.
Heyward.... be really good, sign a big contract and start sucking. But he gave a really good speech once apparently.... and I actually like Heyward...
Sadly his only failure was to sign his deal after a really good year. He has never hit higher than .293, never had more than 82 RBI’s, never had more than 27 HR’s & averaged an OPS+ of around 117 in his career before he signed. He just didn’t “progress” like the Cubs had hoped which is sad for us but that was our fault, not his.. First 6 years: ~25 war Second 6 years: ~8 war Didnt play to expectations, but still gave us or is giving us something. Coulda been worse, like the pujols deal, dishing out negative war numbers, but he's always given us some level of production, even if it sometimes hasnt been much. And he'll always have his good 2020 he gave us.
|
|
|
Post by Returnofstevefitz on Sept 21, 2021 9:01:45 GMT -5
Couple of things I will bring up here since someone decided to bury themselves in it:
1. Jason Heyward is the first person to reach out to every single prospect/rookie that has been called up over the last few years. And, of all the players on the roster of over the last 3-4 years, Jason Heyward is the FIRST player the young guys who get called up talk about as helping them get comfortable in the bigs.
2. Jason Heyward has already been on record saying he wants to stay in Chicago and be a part of what's going on here. Wants to be a veteran who helps the younger guys understand what it takes to be in and stay in the big leagues. The day to day stuff.
Let's all be honest and realistic, we know what Jason Heyward is. But there's nothing wrong with him being a mentor to the younger players, ESPECIALLY, younger players with a lot of hype building around them, exactly what Jason Heyward went through.
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 21, 2021 10:41:25 GMT -5
It's not just all about career path. Personality has a lot to do with it too. I'm not saying Happ would not be a good mentor, but we all know by seeing Heyward and Ross since the day they became teammates in Chicago and how Heyward spoke out about him and why he was paying his on the road suites his last year as a player, totally gets it. Heyward can help Davis be more charitable? No , I guess that one sailed over your head. Heyward totally gets the influence a veteran can have on a young player citing what he did for Ross as an example of a guy not forgetting what somebody did for him when he broke into the league.
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 21, 2021 10:43:15 GMT -5
Couple of things I will bring up here since someone decided to bury themselves in it: 1. Jason Heyward is the first person to reach out to every single prospect/rookie that has been called up over the last few years. And, of all the players on the roster of over the last 3-4 years, Jason Heyward is the FIRST player the young guys who get called up talk about as helping them get comfortable in the bigs. 2. Jason Heyward has already been on record saying he wants to stay in Chicago and be a part of what's going on here. Wants to be a veteran who helps the younger guys understand what it takes to be in and stay in the big leagues. The day to day stuff. Let's all be honest and realistic, we know what Jason Heyward is. But there's nothing wrong with him being a mentor to the younger players, ESPECIALLY, younger players with a lot of hype building around them, exactly what Jason Heyward went through. You nailed it with this post.
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 21, 2021 12:01:41 GMT -5
Well that is kind of a racist-ass opinion... why does Heyward mentor him? Because they are both black? I don't recall people saying Heyward could mentor Schwarber or Happ...
Go ahead and back track and say it's because Heyward is a veteran...
Huh? Yeah that is a pretty ridiculous assessment from someone who seems to be a level headed poster. Maybe they want Hayward to mentor because hes a good outfielder and he is a veteran player. Maybe Hayward should be the mentor because he shouldn't be playing and the younger guys need to get a chance ahead of his known commodity. To say it's racist because their both black is just complete idiocy. Honestly I haven't looked at this board in days but I really hope that was a joke. As Heyward wraps up his worst ever season, we know that we have 2 more years with him under contract. I wouldn't bet that we'd get much production out of him, but he will obviously be stepping into the leadership role a bit more with the young players coming up. I wonder if Jhey might turn in to a coach when his contract is up? And I wonder if he'd want to stick around with the Cubs for that. Duffy, though he still seems to have something to offer as a backup player, could also become a coach. I want them both. By the way, somebody is selling a B-Davis autographed baseball card for $900 on Ebay. Gotta appreciate the hustle, lol. Hope they sell it.
|
|
|
Post by tehmpus on Sept 21, 2021 15:35:02 GMT -5
Well that is kind of a racist-ass opinion... why does Heyward mentor him? Because they are both black? I don't recall people saying Heyward could mentor Schwarber or Happ...
Go ahead and back track and say it's because Heyward is a veteran...
I don't think that his comment was even slightly racist. He is a well respected veteran & the absolute best outfielder on the team. Honestly I didn't even realize that he was black before this comment. Feels pretty good though. I will be racist in stating that some of the best Cubs players of all time were black men, and we haven't had a good one for awhile. Heyward obviously isn't one of the greats.
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 21, 2021 16:02:35 GMT -5
I don't think that his comment was even slightly racist. He is a well respected veteran & the absolute best outfielder on the team. Honestly I didn't even realize that he was black before this comment. Feels pretty good though. I will be racist in stating that some of the best Cubs players of all time were black men, and we haven't had a good one for awhile. Heyward obviously isn't one of the greats. I'm sure I'm missing somebody , and it's not something that ever crossed my mind prior to reading your comment , but I grew up idolizing Billy, Fergie and just caught the very tail end of Ernie and I'd also add in Madlock to the list , but after him , who ? , only Dunston and D. Lee come to mind off the top of my head.
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 21, 2021 23:11:41 GMT -5
Honestly I didn't even realize that he was black before this comment. Feels pretty good though. I will be racist in stating that some of the best Cubs players of all time were black men, and we haven't had a good one for awhile. Heyward obviously isn't one of the greats. I'm sure I'm missing somebody , and it's not something that ever crossed my mind prior to reading your comment , but I grew up idolizing Billy, Fergie and just caught the very tail end of Ernie and I'd also add in Madlock to the list , but after him , who ? , only Dunston and D. Lee come to mind off the top of my head. If it matters, dont forget dexter fowler gave us two strong seasons. Not many years as a cub, but they were special. One of my favorite ever cubs and an absolute key piece of the 2016 team dynamic. Sammy sosa. Soriano. Can't wait for the excitement of seeing brennan davis and some of these other kids come up. I'm ready to contend again dangit- its been far too long! Castellanos, 2 big free agents pitchers, a few 1 year deals, and that's a wild card spot next year. Let's DO it!
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 22, 2021 7:29:44 GMT -5
I'm sure I'm missing somebody , and it's not something that ever crossed my mind prior to reading your comment , but I grew up idolizing Billy, Fergie and just caught the very tail end of Ernie and I'd also add in Madlock to the list , but after him , who ? , only Dunston and D. Lee come to mind off the top of my head. If it matters, dont forget dexter fowler gave us two strong seasons. Not many years as a cub, but they were special. One of my favorite ever cubs and an absolute key piece of the 2016 team dynamic. Sammy sosa. Soriano. Can't wait for the excitement of seeing brennan davis and some of these other kids come up. I'm ready to contend again dangit- its been far too long! Castellanos, 2 big free agents pitchers, a few 1 year deals, and that's a wild card spot next year. Let's DO it! Yes , even though it was a short stay , Dexter for sure would qualify in my opinion. Sammy and Soriano although dark in skin color are not African American
|
|
|
Post by trav768 on Sept 22, 2021 20:18:24 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 23, 2021 8:31:20 GMT -5
I hope they get the service time issue straightned out in a new CBA this winter. I think he's ready , no sense in wasting time in AAA to start 2022 .
|
|
|
Post by bryzzobrist on Sept 23, 2021 13:27:40 GMT -5
I hope they get the service time issue straightned out in a new CBA this winter. I think he's ready , no sense in wasting time in AAA to start 2022 . Well he's about 22 years old. If the CBA includes that 29.5 free agency age, shouldn't hurt us too bad there.
Wouldn't work out very well for Frank or Brainpower though, would it?
|
|
|
Post by happtobehere on Sept 24, 2021 6:40:03 GMT -5
I hope they get the service time issue straightned out in a new CBA this winter. I think he's ready , no sense in wasting time in AAA to start 2022 . Well he's about 22 years old. If the CBA includes that 29.5 free agency age, shouldn't hurt us too bad there.
Wouldn't work out very well for Frank or Brainpower though, would it?
That 29.5 rule that MLB suggested would have to have some sort of clause where a player would still have to have x amount of years service time.
As it will relate to Davis, regardless of what happens with the next CBA, I don't think the Cubs would manipulate Davis's service time after how they were under the spot light in regards to Kris Bryant's service time manipulation.
I think service time will be pushed back far enough that it will deter further manipulation, possibly to the All-Star break or possibly 81 games while also doing away with "super 2" status. There may be some teams that would continue to resist calling up top prospects but I think most playoff teams would certainly think twice about leaving a top guy in the farm for "extra seasoning".
|
|
|
Post by batman66 on Sept 24, 2021 8:39:01 GMT -5
Well he's about 22 years old. If the CBA includes that 29.5 free agency age, shouldn't hurt us too bad there.
Wouldn't work out very well for Frank or Brainpower though, would it?
That 29.5 rule that MLB suggested would have to have some sort of clause where a player would still have to have x amount of years service time.
As it will relate to Davis, regardless of what happens with the next CBA, I don't think the Cubs would manipulate Davis's service time after how they were under the spot light in regards to Kris Bryant's service time manipulation.
I think service time will be pushed back far enough that it will deter further manipulation, possibly to the All-Star break or possibly 81 games while also doing away with "super 2" status. There may be some teams that would continue to resist calling up top prospects but I think most playoff teams would certainly think twice about leaving a top guy in the farm for "extra seasoning".
I don't know how the new CBA will look , and I don't know if they can get him to bite , but after what just happened with not being able to extend any of the hitting core , I'd imagine Jed is going to be floating an Eloy Jimimez like long term deal to Davis .
|
|