How will new rules help/hurt Cubs

[patriot544]

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

[ddevonb]

I think that because they knew the rules coming into the off season, they would take those into account when forming the roster... so I don't see that they would hurt them in any way. How much they might help is also an unknown. Every team has the opportunity to make adjustments to the rules but how many will gain an edge or lose one is not knowable.

I don't assume that teams will just focus on defense with the extra man. Some will, but some will focus on adding speed. An extra position gives some the flexibility to add a speed burner to pinch run is key situations.

Some will want a power bat to pinch hit.

[rvn11]

Not sure quite what to think yet, but the 3 batter rule with the bullpen concerns me. In the past few years they used a lot of relievers, lots of guys went short of the new rule. Part of that may have been Joe, part may have been the organization. But, there are plenty of guys currently in the pen that were previously used situationally and not for a full inning. You'd have to think that the changes will take away some of their effectiveness, and the pen has often been a weaker point in past years. There are some younger guys perhaps capable of breakout, but they can regress just as easily, and a struggling reliever forced to stay in the game can be a recipe for disaster IMO.

Additionally the DL rules will have an impact, particularly in light of how the pen is not solidified at the moment. The Cubs were one of the more guilty parties in the abuse of the 10 day IL slot and this will make it more difficult on them.

[tehmpus]

Feb 17, 2020 13:10:10 GMT -5 patriot544 said:

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

Not sure what the DL changes are, so I won't comment on it (although the Cubs have used the DL very often in the last few years)

3 batter rule will help us.  As you said, we haven't had many 1 out specialist guys (except perhaps Holland).  Our lefty relievers are big time strikeout guys, so they should be able to several outs in a row.  I think this will also affect pitchers that just "don't have it" on a particular day, and can't seem to get anybody out.  We might see some big innings this year as teams aren't able to remove a pitcher who simply is off his game that particular night.  I'm guessing that managers will need to get up their relievers a little earlier to make sure they are ready to go in an inning to avoid such a costly mistake.  

26th man should really help the Cubs.  With 13 pitchers, 8 starting hitters, that used to leave only 4 bench slots.  1 slot was always allocated to a backup catcher, and 1 slot to a backup shortstop.  That leaves the other 3 positions to cover the entire rest of the field.  In short, bench players needed to be capable of playing all around the diamond with positional flexibility.  That extra spot means a National league team could potentially carry a "big bopper" type hitter on the bench that only plays a single position, yet can play DH in American league parks during interleague games.  I wouldn't use the spot for a stolen base specialist.  

[symposiumx]

It will be interesting to see how the 3 out rule for pitchers I’ll impact game time. More offense = longer games. I know it’s about pace of pay and not necessarily length of play, but still.

[rvn11]

Feb 17, 2020 13:43:24 GMT -5 tehmpus said:

Feb 17, 2020 13:10:10 GMT -5 patriot544 said:

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

Not sure what the DL changes are, so I won't comment on it (although the Cubs have used the DL very often in the last few years)

3 batter rule will help us.  As you said, we haven't had many 1 out specialist guys (except perhaps Holland).  Our lefty relievers are big time strikeout guys, so they should be able to several outs in a row.  I think this will also affect pitchers that just "don't have it" on a particular day, and can't seem to get anybody out.  We might see some big innings this year as teams aren't able to remove a pitcher who simply is off his game that particular night.  I'm guessing that managers will need to get up their relievers a little earlier to make sure they are ready to go in an inning to avoid such a costly mistake.  

26th man should really help the Cubs.  With 13 pitchers, 8 starting hitters, that used to leave only 5 bench slots.  1 slot was always allocated to a backup catcher, and 1 slot to a backup shortstop.  That leaves the other 3 positions to cover the entire rest of the field.  In short, bench players needed to be capable of playing all around the diamond with positional flexibility.  That extra spot means a National league team could potentially carry a "big bopper" type hitter on the bench that only plays a single position, yet can play DH in American league parks during interleague games.  I wouldn't use the spot for a stolen base specialist.  

New DL rule is 15 days for pitchers instead of 10.

[Deleted]

Feb 17, 2020 13:10:10 GMT -5 patriot544 said:

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

I don't think the DH rule will effect the Cubs much. 

The 26th man should help any team but the Cubs didn't really "stash" any specialist on their roster, i.e. a speed specialist, lefty power bat, etc. I thought Kemp was a good fit the 26th spot because he had some speed but I also felt he was a perfect situational hitter. I hated the way Maddon used Kemp, I would have saved him for situations when you absolutely had to put bat on ball... RISP with less than two outs or if you needed to execute a hit and run etc. 

I dislike the 3 batter minimum as I understand it. I think if a team makes a move, you should be able to counter said move. Example being, if you bring a lefty reliever into the game and you have, lets say back to back lefties or L/R/L and the opposing team pulls their lefty hitter then you should be allowed to counter that move. How this rule will effect how teams handle the 26th man will be interesting. For instance, maybe you keep a Matt Adams on your roster just for those situations because you know the opposing team cannot counter bringing him in. That to me has always been the biggest issue with the three batter minimum, the inability to counter opposing moves. 

[thisbuds4u]

I hate the 3 batter rule. A ML manager should be allowed to manage a game. If a pitcher is struggling, he should not have to wait before he can remove him. As it sits, the only way to remove a struggling pitcher is for him to call the umpire "a walking pile of pig shit". Joe West will love that.

[jerm42991]

Feb 17, 2020 16:34:02 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

I hate the 3 batter rule. A ML manager should be allowed to manage a game. If a pitcher is struggling, he should not have to wait before he can remove him. As it sits, the only way to remove a struggling pitcher is for him to call the umpire "a walking pile of pig shit". Joe West will love that.

The number of times where a guy was pulled after 1 or 2 batters because he was struggling was minimal. 99%+ of the times a pitcher faces less than 3 batters in 1 inning is because of matchup

[thisbuds4u]

Feb 17, 2020 16:57:03 GMT -5 jerm42991 said:

Feb 17, 2020 16:34:02 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

I hate the 3 batter rule. A ML manager should be allowed to manage a game. If a pitcher is struggling, he should not have to wait before he can remove him. As it sits, the only way to remove a struggling pitcher is for him to call the umpire "a walking pile of pig shit". Joe West will love that.

The number of times where a guy was pulled after 1 or 2 batters because he was struggling was minimal. 99%+ of the times a pitcher faces less than 3 batters in 1 inning is because of matchup

It is not minimal. Not all relievers are brought in to start an inning. Many times their are men on base when a pitcher is brought in. It's unfair to tie one manager's hands, regarding a pitcher, but allow the other manager to substitute for a pinch-hitter. To make the rule fair, a pitching change should be allowed when the offense makes a substitution. I'm not sure where you came up with 99% but if it effects 5% of the games, which amounts to 8 games, that's a huge number in the standings. It's also unrealistic to expect a pitcher to be effective every time out. 

[patriot544]

Feb 17, 2020 17:25:31 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

Feb 17, 2020 16:57:03 GMT -5 jerm42991 said:

The number of times where a guy was pulled after 1 or 2 batters because he was struggling was minimal. 99%+ of the times a pitcher faces less than 3 batters in 1 inning is because of matchup

It is not minimal. Not all relievers are brought in to start an inning. Many times their are men on base when a pitcher is brought in. It's unfair to tie one manager's hands, regarding a pitcher, but allow the other manager to substitute for a pinch-hitter. To make the rule fair, a pitching change should be allowed when the offense makes a substitution. I'm not sure where you came up with 99% but if it effects 5% of the games, which amounts to 8 games, that's a huge number in the standings. It's also unrealistic to expect a pitcher to be effective every time out. 

I like your idea of a pitching change can be made only when a substitution is made if less than three outs. Although I think it’s a great rule I personally want more offense so I look at this rule should bring in more offense.

[jerm42991]

Feb 17, 2020 17:25:31 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

Feb 17, 2020 16:57:03 GMT -5 jerm42991 said:

The number of times where a guy was pulled after 1 or 2 batters because he was struggling was minimal. 99%+ of the times a pitcher faces less than 3 batters in 1 inning is because of matchup

It is not minimal. Not all relievers are brought in to start an inning. Many times their are men on base when a pitcher is brought in. It's unfair to tie one manager's hands, regarding a pitcher, but allow the other manager to substitute for a pinch-hitter. To make the rule fair, a pitching change should be allowed when the offense makes a substitution. I'm not sure where you came up with 99% but if it effects 5% of the games, which amounts to 8 games, that's a huge number in the standings. It's also unrealistic to expect a pitcher to be effective every time out. 

How many times have you seen a pitcher come in, walk the batter on 4 pitches and get pulled? Unless the intent all along was for that pitcher to only face 1 batter, it almost never happens

I cant count the number of game threads where people screamed to get a guy out and the manager didnt

[thisbuds4u]

Feb 17, 2020 18:05:55 GMT -5 jerm42991 said:

Feb 17, 2020 17:25:31 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

It is not minimal. Not all relievers are brought in to start an inning. Many times their are men on base when a pitcher is brought in. It's unfair to tie one manager's hands, regarding a pitcher, but allow the other manager to substitute for a pinch-hitter. To make the rule fair, a pitching change should be allowed when the offense makes a substitution. I'm not sure where you came up with 99% but if it effects 5% of the games, which amounts to 8 games, that's a huge number in the standings. It's also unrealistic to expect a pitcher to be effective every time out. 

How many times have you seen a pitcher come in, walk the batter on 4 pitches and get pulled? Unless the intent all along was for that pitcher to only face 1 batter, it almost never happens

I cant count the number of game threads where people screamed to get a guy out and the manager didnt

At least the manager had that option. That was one of the biggest complaints with Maddon, was bullpen management. NOW, people will still scream but it will be because of this rule. And all a manager can do is watch like the rest of us. 

[bryzzobrist]

Feb 17, 2020 13:10:10 GMT -5 patriot544 said:

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

I'd like to see a defensive replacement guy that can steal bases like nobody's business.   I wish we had Terrance Gore back right now.  After all, he managed to hit something like .270 last year at the MLB level as well.  a .270 guy with solid defense and wheels sounds freakin great right now.  Maybe not him exactly, but somebody who can accomplish that for us, regardless of the bat is who we could use on the team

[ddevonb]

Feb 17, 2020 13:42:59 GMT -5 rvn11 said:

Not sure quite what to think yet, but the 3 batter rule with the bullpen concerns me. In the past few years they used a lot of relievers, lots of guys went short of the new rule. Part of that may have been Joe, part may have been the organization. But, there are plenty of guys currently in the pen that were previously used situationally and not for a full inning. You'd have to think that the changes will take away some of their effectiveness, and the pen has often been a weaker point in past years. There are some younger guys perhaps capable of breakout, but they can regress just as easily, and a struggling reliever forced to stay in the game can be a recipe for disaster IMO.

Additionally the DL rules will have an impact, particularly in light of how the pen is not solidified at the moment. The Cubs were one of the more guilty parties in the abuse of the 10 day IL slot and this will make it more difficult on them.

There were no guilty parties of a abuse. Using the rules to you maximum benefits is not an abuse. They will have the option to send guys with potions down and bring someone else up. Signing so many guys for those roles will allow a lot of flexibility. Of course the bullpen not being solidified now is not important is it is solidified coming out of ST.

[ddevonb]

Feb 17, 2020 17:25:31 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

Feb 17, 2020 16:57:03 GMT -5 jerm42991 said:

The number of times where a guy was pulled after 1 or 2 batters because he was struggling was minimal. 99%+ of the times a pitcher faces less than 3 batters in 1 inning is because of matchup

It is not minimal. Not all relievers are brought in to start an inning. Many times their are men on base when a pitcher is brought in. It's unfair to tie one manager's hands, regarding a pitcher, but allow the other manager to substitute for a pinch-hitter. To make the rule fair, a pitching change should be allowed when the offense makes a substitution. I'm not sure where you came up with 99% but if it effects 5% of the games, which amounts to 8 games, that's a huge number in the standings. It's also unrealistic to expect a pitcher to be effective every time out. 

It's not about fairness, but it is fair because both teams play by the same rules. The goal is to keep the game moving.

[rvn11]

Feb 18, 2020 16:51:20 GMT -5 ddevonb said:

Feb 17, 2020 13:42:59 GMT -5 rvn11 said:

Not sure quite what to think yet, but the 3 batter rule with the bullpen concerns me. In the past few years they used a lot of relievers, lots of guys went short of the new rule. Part of that may have been Joe, part may have been the organization. But, there are plenty of guys currently in the pen that were previously used situationally and not for a full inning. You'd have to think that the changes will take away some of their effectiveness, and the pen has often been a weaker point in past years. There are some younger guys perhaps capable of breakout, but they can regress just as easily, and a struggling reliever forced to stay in the game can be a recipe for disaster IMO.

Additionally the DL rules will have an impact, particularly in light of how the pen is not solidified at the moment. The Cubs were one of the more guilty parties in the abuse of the 10 day IL slot and this will make it more difficult on them.

There were no guilty parties of a abuse. Using the rules to you maximum benefits is not an abuse. They will have the option to send guys with potions down and bring someone else up. Signing so many guys for those roles will allow a lot of flexibility. Of course the bullpen not being solidified now is not important is it is solidified coming out of ST.

Well, in 2017 when LA was doing it and using it as a way to stash pitchers rather than using options everybody was crying foul. Sure they were using the rules to their advantage, but if they weren't abusing the rules they wouldn't have changed it. Additionally most of the injuries claimed generally weren't valid issues, thus it encouraged dishonest use of the IL slot and defeated the intended use.

[chubbycub]

Feb 17, 2020 13:10:10 GMT -5 patriot544 said:

Would love to get all of your opinions on how all the rules changed will help or hurt the cubs. The only three main ones I saw were the three batter rule, 26 man and DL changes.

For the 3 batter rule I think it hurts the cubs less than most because we don’t really have or use a lefty only specialist. Also since Ross is a new manager he doesn’t have old tendencies to break.

For the 26th man I think it could allow us to bring a defensive outfielder allowing us to have some flexibility with our lineup.

DL in my mind is going back to the correct rule because too many teams are abusing the rule.

The 3 batter rule doesn't change the fact that when you are called from the pen, you are supposed to get outs RIGHT NOW! (something the Cubs pen hasn't done consistently since .......)

I kinda like it and kinda don't because we all know it's possible to have a lousy warmup and then K the batter(s) or have a great warmup and then throw batting practice.

[thisbuds4u]

After just 6 games, I hope MLB gets rid of the 3 batter rule next season. There are not enough good relievers in baseball. And I believe you will see more injuries because of the high pitch counts.

[idontcare]

Jul 30, 2020 14:03:47 GMT -5 thisbuds4u said:

After just 6 games, I hope MLB gets rid of the 3 batter rule next season. There are not enough good relievers in baseball. And I believe you will see more injuries because of the high pitch counts.

I don't mind the three batter rule but I feel it was something that needed to be implemented with more advanced knowledge, like not instituted until the new CBA so teams could make free agent signings, roster moves etc accordingly. I also think, kind of like challenges, you should get one time where you can pull a reliever early in a game. That way you as a manager can use either strategically or as a safety net incase your reliever simply cannot throw strikes. There is no since in forcing a team to watch a guy walk the bases loaded IMO.