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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 13:26:36 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July.
Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof.
OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day..
Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well.
Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay..
Now the "Wants"
It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy.
Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is..
Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series..
Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years..
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Post by irishcubfan on May 24, 2021 14:19:27 GMT -5
Cubs may be the most interesting team to watch in June and July as far as what they will do.
SD wouldn't give up Abrams or Gore for Darvish, highly doubtful they would for a half of season of KB.
No way TB trades Franco.
Cubs can do much, much better than Frazier as a return for Rizzo and plus.
Doubt Cubs will get as much as they gave up for Chapman with Kimbrel. The Cubs likely viewed Chapman as the final piece to the puzzle in a very long drought.
Hoyer and company are going to have major decisions to make and it will be a fascinating month or two.
Thankfully the minors are up and running so they will have a bit more data and info on prospects for this trade season.
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Post by lajoiesghost on May 24, 2021 14:27:35 GMT -5
I can't see Tampa giving up Franco. They don't part with top affordable talent and won't trade unless they can screw the pants off of someone.
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Post by happtobehere on May 24, 2021 14:44:21 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. First, there is no way the Rays will take that trade... Teams do not trade the top ranked prospect in baseball period. The Dodgers didn't even part with their systems ranked prospect to attain Betts and that was for longer than half a season.
It will be very interesting to see what Hoyer does in the coming weeks, depending on how the Cubs play, it's not out of the question for them to push all their chips in and make one last run for a Title (similar to the Nationals a few years ago).
Now it's worth noting that the Nationals really didn't make any crazy impact trades in 2019 the way the Cubs will need to if they hope to take a fringe playoff caliber team to a World Series contender. The Cubs really need two front line starters and I think it would be ill advised to decimate the farm to do so. The 'good" news for the Cubs is that possibly they could take on quite a bit of salary to facilitate trade. Lets just say, for instance, the Giants fell out of contention, the Cubs could get Cueto in very little in terms of talent. Not saying Cueto is a guy the Cubs would or should target, I was just using him as an example.
If the Cubs were to shop Bryant plus cash to the Rays, Brujan plus should be a reasonable get. Rizzo and Kimbrel both, plus cash, we would probably be looking at a package centered around either Walls or Edwards plus.
If it were me, with a trade surrounding Bryant, I would target Brujan and either Baz or McClanahan. I'd be willing to add another piece to the package to get it done. Rizzo and Kimbrel, I'd shoot for Edwards and either Baz or McClanahan.
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 16:01:31 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. First, there is no way the Rays will take that trade... Teams do not trade the top ranked prospect in baseball period. The Dodgers didn't even part with their systems ranked prospect to attain Betts and that was for longer than half a season.
It will be very interesting to see what Hoyer does in the coming weeks, depending on how the Cubs play, it's not out of the question for them to push all their chips in and make one last run for a Title (similar to the Nationals a few years ago).
Now it's worth noting that the Nationals really didn't make any crazy impact trades in 2019 the way the Cubs will need to if they hope to take a fringe playoff caliber team to a World Series contender. The Cubs really need two front line starters and I think it would be ill advised to decimate the farm to do so. The 'good" news for the Cubs is that possibly they could take on quite a bit of salary to facilitate trade. Lets just say, for instance, the Giants fell out of contention, the Cubs could get Cueto in very little in terms of talent. Not saying Cueto is a guy the Cubs would or should target, I was just using him as an example.
If the Cubs were to shop Bryant plus cash to the Rays, Brujan plus should be a reasonable get. Rizzo and Kimbrel both, plus cash, we would probably be looking at a package centered around either Walls or Edwards plus.
If it were me, with a trade surrounding Bryant, I would target Brujan and either Baz or McClanahan. I'd be willing to add another piece to the package to get it done. Rizzo and Kimbrel, I'd shoot for Edwards and either Baz or McClanahan.
Do you remember what the Cubs gave up for 9 weeks of Aroldis Chapman?? ""The Cubs acquired Chapman from the Yankees on Monday in exchange for four players: pitcher Adam Warren and prospects Gleyber Torres, Billy McKinney and Rashad Crawford. Torres, a 19-year-old shortstop, was the top-ranked prospect in the Cubs' system and ranks 24th in baseball according to MLB Pipeline."" Gleyber Torres was a great get especially when coupled with the others. Yes teams do trade their top ranked prospects as you can see & it netted us a championship..
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Post by rvn11 on May 24, 2021 16:35:43 GMT -5
IMO Kimbrel to the Padres is the deal they should be making. They're one of the best teams in the game right now and a closer like Kimbrel could be the difference maker. Melancon is pitching out of his mind at the moment, but if you're the SD front office do you really want him on the mound in a big spot in the playoffs or World Series? I think not. You have to think he'll come back down to earth. Padres have made the moves and trades to show they're in it for this year and the future, and have the farm system to make it worthwhile for the Cubs in a way they didn't for Darvish. Kimbrel is the piece to put them over the top at the moment, you just have to wait for them to be convinced he's worth the prospect price tag.
I'm torn on what to do with the others. Position players just haven't gotten much in terms of return the past few years, and I don't know if a team would pay a premium for Rizzo or Javy the way they're playing. KB is proving he's worth a premium for any team at any position, but I don't know if teams would make a move that would benefit the Cubs enough to be worthwhile.
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Post by rvn11 on May 24, 2021 16:39:52 GMT -5
Do you remember what the Cubs gave up for 9 weeks of Aroldis Chapman?? ""The Cubs acquired Chapman from the Yankees on Monday in exchange for four players: pitcher Adam Warren and prospects Gleyber Torres, Billy McKinney and Rashad Crawford. Torres, a 19-year-old shortstop, was the top-ranked prospect in the Cubs' system and ranks 24th in baseball according to MLB Pipeline."" Gleyber Torres was a great get especially when coupled with the others. Yes teams do trade their top ranked prospects as you can see & it netted us a championship.. Honestly, I think teams have looked at what the Cubs and Indians did that season, and how much the Yankees benefited from it and are hesitant to repeat that type of move. Those were 2 franchises with the longest WS droughts making moves almost in desperation to end them. It worked out pretty well for both in the short term, but the long term ramifications are quite evident right now and teams are afraid of that. You need to find a team and a front office that desperately wants to win right now to find that type of return, and the only front office that been consistently that hungry and aggressive IMO is San Diego. Maybe the White Sox but they have Hendriks in place and Kopech to back him up to avoid the need to overpay.
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 19:19:17 GMT -5
Do you remember what the Cubs gave up for 9 weeks of Aroldis Chapman?? ""The Cubs acquired Chapman from the Yankees on Monday in exchange for four players: pitcher Adam Warren and prospects Gleyber Torres, Billy McKinney and Rashad Crawford. Torres, a 19-year-old shortstop, was the top-ranked prospect in the Cubs' system and ranks 24th in baseball according to MLB Pipeline."" Gleyber Torres was a great get especially when coupled with the others. Yes teams do trade their top ranked prospects as you can see & it netted us a championship.. Honestly, I think teams have looked at what the Cubs and Indians did that season, and how much the Yankees benefited from it and are hesitant to repeat that type of move. Those were 2 franchises with the longest WS droughts making moves almost in desperation to end them. It worked out pretty well for both in the short term, but the long term ramifications are quite evident right now and teams are afraid of that. You need to find a team and a front office that desperately wants to win right now to find that type of return, and the only front office that been consistently that hungry and aggressive IMO is San Diego. Maybe the White Sox but they have Hendriks in place and Kopech to back him up to avoid the need to overpay. I tend to agree which is why I mentioned the Padres & the Rays but to some extent the Yankees as well. The first 2 fit the bill & the Yankees a little just because going even 10 years without a title is getting annoying to them & their fans. The flip side of that issue is no rookie is guaranteed to ever produce as advertised but if a team picks up KB & Kimbrel it’s 96% sure they will produce much more than the guys they replace..
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 19:21:02 GMT -5
IMO Kimbrel to the Padres is the deal they should be making. They're one of the best teams in the game right now and a closer like Kimbrel could be the difference maker. Melancon is pitching out of his mind at the moment, but if you're the SD front office do you really want him on the mound in a big spot in the playoffs or World Series? I think not. You have to think he'll come back down to earth. Padres have made the moves and trades to show they're in it for this year and the future, and have the farm system to make it worthwhile for the Cubs in a way they didn't for Darvish. Kimbrel is the piece to put them over the top at the moment, you just have to wait for them to be convinced he's worth the prospect price tag. I'm torn on what to do with the others. Position players just haven't gotten much in terms of return the past few years, and I don't know if a team would pay a premium for Rizzo or Javy the way they're playing. KB is proving he's worth a premium for any team at any position, but I don't know if teams would make a move that would benefit the Cubs enough to be worthwhile. Thats exactly what I saw as well & I added the additional player(s) in order to get back their best prospect..
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Post by addisondad on May 24, 2021 19:49:32 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. Personally I would hate to see any of these guys go, but something has to happen. That said, Javy would be my first pick to deal. I do believe he will do well in free agency and not be a Cub next year. So getting anything for him now would be a plus. He would be missed but I think we have to get used to him not being on the north side anyway.
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Post by rvn11 on May 24, 2021 19:50:02 GMT -5
Honestly, I think teams have looked at what the Cubs and Indians did that season, and how much the Yankees benefited from it and are hesitant to repeat that type of move. Those were 2 franchises with the longest WS droughts making moves almost in desperation to end them. It worked out pretty well for both in the short term, but the long term ramifications are quite evident right now and teams are afraid of that. You need to find a team and a front office that desperately wants to win right now to find that type of return, and the only front office that been consistently that hungry and aggressive IMO is San Diego. Maybe the White Sox but they have Hendriks in place and Kopech to back him up to avoid the need to overpay. I tend to agree which is why I mentioned the Padres & the Rays but to some extent the Yankees as well. The first 2 fit the bill & the Yankees a little just because going even 10 years without a title is getting annoying to them & their fans. The flip side of that issue is no rookie is guaranteed to ever produce as advertised but if a team picks up KB & Kimbrel it’s 96% sure they will produce much more than the guys they replace.. The only issue is that the Rays will never be major buyers imo to the level the cubs will need. They are always on the rebuild and such a move is counter to their standard philosophy.
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Post by chubbycub on May 24, 2021 19:59:41 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. I don't think "selling the house" would necessarily an item for Rizzo. He lives in Ft Lauderdale, close to where he grew up That makes the Yankmees a little more attractive since they spring train in Tampa. LOL
So let me understand this...you're trading Rizzo because you want a World Series NOW not later, but you're not inviting him to contribute anything to this one except his trade value. I don't think Jed would ever do that. They have been through WAAAAY too much together.
If I was put in that situation through some crazy machinations that are not shrewd this time, and I won a World Series with my new team (or maybe even if NOT, if we made the playoffs and the Cubs didn't), I wouldn't answer the phone from the Cubs. New York has money, too.
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 21:12:08 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. Personally I would hate to see any of these guys go, but something has to happen. That said, Javy would be my first pick to deal. I do believe he will do well in free agency and not be a Cub next year. So getting anything for him now would be a plus. He would be missed but I think we have to get used to him not being on the north side anyway. I just feel he will bring back less than the other big 3 & I think he is “signable” if they choose to do so.
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 21:15:27 GMT -5
I tend to agree which is why I mentioned the Padres & the Rays but to some extent the Yankees as well. The first 2 fit the bill & the Yankees a little just because going even 10 years without a title is getting annoying to them & their fans. The flip side of that issue is no rookie is guaranteed to ever produce as advertised but if a team picks up KB & Kimbrel it’s 96% sure they will produce much more than the guys they replace.. The only issue is that the Rays will never be major buyers imo to the level the cubs will need. They are always on the rebuild and such a move is counter to their standard philosophy. Generally I agree, but they are just close enough this year that if they really want to go all in & shoot for a championship those 2 Cubs might just get it done. You could be looking at an additional 6 to 8 wins in the regular season & who knows in the playoffs.
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Post by fine09 on May 24, 2021 21:20:08 GMT -5
Honestly I would be seriously bummed out if they did make these moves right now because there is a chance we really could win the Central this year. But, for long term planning we really should make some of these moves sooner rather than later - unless another division title & then nada is good enough AND we get maybe the 43rd. pick in the draft for KB & then maybe the 77th. pick for Rizzo. Nope - sorry folks but that just isn't good enough & if we do make a big trade or two now or pretty soon we will get substantially more than if we were to wait until July. Most every competitive team needs good Bull pen help right now & we have quite a few guys pitching so far above their career numbers that it is crazy not to package them & get a really nice return because we lose them anyway so why not sell when their value is through the roof. OK, KB is putting up MVP type numbers damn near across the board & is playing 5 or 6 positions very well so now is the time to make some really absurd requests for a return on him & see where it goes. It would be horibly hard to see him go but he really is gone at the seasons end so why not improve the team dramatically for the future now as opposed to waiting & get 1 guy we "hope" might be a starter one day.. Teams might not have a dire need for a great closer right now so maybe waiting a few more weeks until something bad happens to one of the big teams closers but trading Kimbrel seems like a deal that would bring back a ton, similar to Aroldis, especially with his numbers off the charts now & a 16 mil. option for next year as well. Anthony really needs to be dealt in 2 weeks to a month but before he is you sit him down & say we want you back & to retire as a Cub so we will be the winning bidder this winter so don't sell your house.. I can picture him as a Yankee for the remainder of the season pretty easily & he would hate it there so he shouldn't be tempted to want to stay.. Now the "Wants" It might very well take a creative 3-team deal but I 'd really like Clint Frazer from the Yankees for Rizzo & 1 very good BP guy. Send Rizzo & Kimbrel (with 14 million to help with salaries) to Tampa for the #1 prospect in all of MLB Wander Franco. Yes please - but only if you guys really want to win the World Series this year that is.. Or maybe send KB & 2 of the top BP arms for their top guys Gore or Abrams. Also, only if you guys want to beat the Dodgers & go to the World Series.. Like I said, this would suck terribly but it's going to suck even worse if we don't & that sucking might last for years & years.. I don't think "selling the house" would necessarily an item for Rizzo. He lives in Ft Lauderdale, close to where he grew up That makes the Yankmees a little more attractive since they spring train in Tampa. LOL
So let me understand this...you're trading Rizzo because you want a World Series NOW not later, but you're not inviting him to contribute anything to this one except his trade value. I don't think Jed would ever do that. They have been through WAAAAY too much together.
If I was put in that situation through some crazy machinations that are not shrewd this time, and I won a World Series with my new team (or maybe even if NOT, if we made the playoffs and the Cubs didn't), I wouldn't answer the phone from the Cubs. New York has money, too.
If Anthony does love the Cubs as much as we hope he is smart enough to figure out that if he does come back to the team with a brighter future than it was just 6 months earlier, that is a good thing.. If he doesn’t then he probably wasn’t going to come back regardless so nothing lost but quite a bit gained in potential anyway
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Post by happtobehere on May 24, 2021 21:23:46 GMT -5
IMO Kimbrel to the Padres is the deal they should be making. They're one of the best teams in the game right now and a closer like Kimbrel could be the difference maker. Melancon is pitching out of his mind at the moment, but if you're the SD front office do you really want him on the mound in a big spot in the playoffs or World Series? I think not. You have to think he'll come back down to earth. Padres have made the moves and trades to show they're in it for this year and the future, and have the farm system to make it worthwhile for the Cubs in a way they didn't for Darvish. Kimbrel is the piece to put them over the top at the moment, you just have to wait for them to be convinced he's worth the prospect price tag. I'm torn on what to do with the others. Position players just haven't gotten much in terms of return the past few years, and I don't know if a team would pay a premium for Rizzo or Javy the way they're playing. KB is proving he's worth a premium for any team at any position, but I don't know if teams would make a move that would benefit the Cubs enough to be worthwhile. .351/.468/.486 - Rizzo the past 14 days.
It's kind of been Rizzo's MO in his career it seems, he will have hit a handful of home runs early but have a low batting average, then he will flip, hit for a high batting average with no power and then he balances out.
I think the only team starving for a championship right now is the Yankees. They are the only ones I think that are desperate enough to overpay. Not overpay the Cubs overpaid for Chapman but overpay all the same. I don't believe that the Padres are in "World Series or bust" mode just yet.
The good news is that either Baez, Bryant or Rizzo would fit the Yankees perfectly so if Hoyer does decide to trade, he has his options in dealing with New York.
Bryant and Kimbrel both make sense for the Padres since Pham isn't giving them much production and neither is Myers.
Any team looking for relief help will be banging down Hoyer's door (for a change) the pen has been lights out and we still haven't seen Wick yet.
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Post by addisondad on May 24, 2021 21:24:06 GMT -5
Personally I would hate to see any of these guys go, but something has to happen. That said, Javy would be my first pick to deal. I do believe he will do well in free agency and not be a Cub next year. So getting anything for him now would be a plus. He would be missed but I think we have to get used to him not being on the north side anyway. I just feel he will bring back less than the other big 3 & I think he is “signable” if they choose to do so. Very true, but at this moment Javy leads in home runs and RBI. He also leads in errors and strike outs. I really think Rizzo will wind up staying long term more than the others. Simply for sentimental reasons. Javy for all his faults is still an amazing and exciting ball player and would sell a lot of seats on another team this year. Plus letting Rizzo go for half a season would jeopardize him coming back and a mid season trade would more than upset the Cubs faithful more than letting Baez go. Plus I could see the Yankees taking Javy in a heartbeat an pairing him up with Gleyber. And maybe getting someone decent in return. Just my thought.
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Post by addisondad on May 24, 2021 21:34:28 GMT -5
I have no idea what Jed is going to do and don't envy his job right now. But I feel for Rossy at this point as he has had a rough go managing a team with a high payroll for what it is.
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Post by thisbuds4u on May 24, 2021 21:43:57 GMT -5
Maybe keeping most of this team intact would be best.
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Post by happtobehere on May 24, 2021 22:09:03 GMT -5
Maybe keeping most of this team intact would be best. I think the Cubs should attempt to trade Baez, Contreras, Kimbrel and Winkler. I think those are three guys that will give us a fairly decent return without giving us a "death kiss".
IMO, the Cubs could trade Baez and in turn, trade for Simmons. If the Cubs feel Amaya can step into the starting back stop, Contreras should bring back a haul!
Kimbrel and Winkler could be replaced by Wick when he is healthy and ready to come back and continue to infuse younger arms from the farm... maybe Marquez depending on his development.
The real issue however is starting pitching. Even if Hendricks continues to pitch like an ace and Alzolay continues developing into a three, we still lack a true formidable one/two. How much are we really going to give up for a guy like Scherzer?
I think the big question is, how does Hoyer feel about the Darvish haul? A lot of people complained about the Darvish haul but I believe we received a lot of really talented, high upside players who could easily break into the top 100 in time. Howard and Hernandez are really exciting also.
It's an interesting year for sure, Cubs have so much talent in the last two years of their contracts that they could fire sell and end up having the best farm system in all of baseball... or they can push their chips in for a run at one more title. They are playing very well, still a lot of baseball to be played by the deadline so anything can happen. I don't think you can nibble though like the Cubs have in the past.
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